By now most folks shooting Hasselblad digital realize that with Phocus Mobile 2, Hasselblad released HNNR, which is their AI ruled noise reduction application. And the good news is HNNR does an excellent job of removing both excess noise and more importantly hot pixels, (which for me become problematic at times with the X2D). However besides the terrible workflow to get to HNNR there is a much bigger issue. If you use HNNR and create a new 3FR raw, you can no longer use Phocus Desktop software on these files as Phocus desktop adds extra noise reduction and in most cases, removes all the finer details. The catch: if you can't use Phocus Desktop, you can no longer take advantage of HNCS.

For me purchasing the X2D camera and lenses was all about HNCS. I had read enough about it for years but until you try their software you can't really see the difference. And there is a difference. You see much better colors, shadow recovery, and even at times better details. If you are using Lr/ACR with the X2D or any other Hasselblad camera, I feel you are missing out on the single most important aspect of their system.

I finally reached out to Hasselblad support about this problem and their response was less then stellar: "From my understanding, noise reduction for Phocus desktop is automated and cannot be disabled. This is an intentional feature that likely will not be removed anytime soon."  So this implies that for the near and far term if you want to use Phocus desktop to enable HNCS, then you can't use HNNR!.  Personally I can't believe this is the response and that they are not able to add a feature to Phocus so that this issue doesn't occur on import.  Adobe seems able to do it why not Hasselblad, after all it's their software?  Amazing.

Just to show that the issue is not minor I have included some screen shots to show examples.



Phocus Mobile 2 HNNR 3FR imported to Phocus Desktop, note the total smearing of the finer details due to the extra noise reduction over applied by Phocus Desktop.



Here is same area from non HNNR 3FR imported into Phocus.  I had all noise reduction turned off in Phocus Desktop at the time.  But you can clearly see the image hold vastly more details.  There are quite a few hot pixels that HNNR can remove but cannot be removed by Phocus.



Small crop showing the total loss of needle details when Phocus Desktop over applies noise reduction to an HNNR 3FR.



Same area straight 3FR imported to Phocus Desktop.  Noise is there, again but the detail are also there and the some of the noise can be fixed. 



No doubt HNNR can do an excellent job as shown here.

One response I received from Hasselblad was to just export the HNNR's from Phocus Mobile 2 as tif and work on them.   Again not what I want to do, I might as well not be shooting raw.

And many still feel that the "camera standard" profile in Lr is OK.  I have tried over and over to make this work, but it's not going to give anywhere the same colors as HNCS.  So that's out.  See examples below.



Lr Version



Phocus Desktop Version

Really the only thing I find that Lr/ACR does better is the ability to save highlights as Phocus even with the recovery slider misses extreme highlights.  But in these two examples the greens are so much better along with the overall blend of color and the sky is vastly superior.  Shadows are also much better resolved in Phocus as Lr tends to blacken shadows too much.

By creating the HNNR process, Hasselblad has moved quickly to the fore front of noise reduction processing, albeit at a total loss of the cornerstone of their entire digital camera marketing and prowess HNCS.  The fact that Hasselblad has not released anything about  to an upcoming fix for this issue is frankly an amazing oversight.

Note on comparison images: Please understand that Phocus Desktop has a very limited toolset i.e. sky select is not an option.  The image shown of 9797 from Phocus has a lot of problems in the upper right due to the inability to select the sky and then invert it to help pull up the shadows on the trees to the right.  This was fixed later on.  I wanted to show this view more for the difference in color.

Obvious everyone has different priorities and how they process out files.  I used my standard process with in Lr and Phocus to gain what I felt was the best representation of the image.  I feel strongly that Lr limits X2D raw conversion with the "camera standard" color profile.

Paul C

I noticed this same problem. I too did a bunch of tests. Don't remember if I posted them here. Phocus Desktop applies a double layer of noise reduction as per my response from Hasselblad below. Makes it completely useless. Ironically LR imports the HNNR file correctly and it looks similar to the sharpness in Phocus mobile but the colors are incorrect. Here's what HB said:


"Hi Mario,

Thank you for contacting Hasselblad Support!

This is likely being caused by the automatic noise reduction which Phocus desktop applies to imported images. Therefore, it probably looks like you are applying double the level of noise reduction, which would give it that waxy look you have been describing. This is also why this does not happen when importing to Lightroom as well."

BTW - there is no way to turn off this second round of noise correction. Setting the sliders to 0 or even a negative number has no effect. Apparently it is applied to all photos regardless of the settings but we may not notice it ordinarily.

Quote from: vidio on March 21, 2025, 12:45:19 PM... Apparently it is applied to all photos regardless of the settings but we may not notice it ordinarily.
...

An unfortunate answer from Hasselblad Support "we may not notice it ordinarily" - obviously we do notice it, as you have shown.

I am now convinced that there will be no new Phocus Desktop version until the X2DII is released.

I am also waiting for a new Phocus Mobile 2 version after I reported what I consider to be a critical sharpening bug (sharpening does not work in edit mode, only when exporting) around 2 weeks ago and this was confirmed.
,,Please be informed that the mentioned issue will be fixed in the upcoming Phocus V3.2.".

I also assume that we won't see any further firmware updates for the X2D, as otherwise there would be no reason to buy the successor (perhaps with AF-C, high-performance Ai autofocus, eye-tracking, BW mode...).

I'm surprised that a company brings out top hardware but sometimes acts sluggishly with the software. A professional workflow (HNCS HNNR) is hardly possible at the moment.

Not to derail the tread, but I have to ask: what is the point of the Phocus Mobile as an image processing application? Is your iPad D50 calibrated? Tethered capture, crop and rotation. That's about all I, (self proclaimed Luddite with $8000 Eizo displays), can think the Mobile is useful for.

Quote from: Iskander on March 21, 2025, 09:12:47 PMI am now convinced that there will be no new Phocus Desktop version until the X2DII is released.

I am also waiting for a new Phocus Mobile 2 version after I reported what I consider to be a critical sharpening bug (sharpening does not work in edit mode, only when exporting) around 2 weeks ago and this was confirmed.
,,Please be informed that the mentioned issue will be fixed in the upcoming Phocus V3.2.".

I also assume that we won't see any further firmware updates for the X2D, as otherwise there would be no reason to buy the successor (perhaps with AF-C, high-performance Ai autofocus, eye-tracking, BW mode...).

I'm surprised that a company brings out top hardware but sometimes acts sluggishly with the software. A professional workflow (HNCS HNNR) is hardly possible at the moment.

Why does a professional workflow have to include editing in the Phocus Mobile?

Quote from: SrMi on March 22, 2025, 10:40:16 AM

Quote from: Iskander on March 21, 2025, 09:12:47 PMI am now convinced that there will be no new Phocus Desktop version until the X2DII is released.

I am also waiting for a new Phocus Mobile 2 version after I reported what I consider to be a critical sharpening bug (sharpening does not work in edit mode, only when exporting) around 2 weeks ago and this was confirmed.
,,Please be informed that the mentioned issue will be fixed in the upcoming Phocus V3.2.".

I also assume that we won't see any further firmware updates for the X2D, as otherwise there would be no reason to buy the successor (perhaps with AF-C, high-performance Ai autofocus, eye-tracking, BW mode...).

I'm surprised that a company brings out top hardware but sometimes acts sluggishly with the software. A professional workflow (HNCS HNNR) is hardly possible at the moment.

Why does a professional workflow have to include editing in the Phocus Mobile?

I thought it was clear what I was trying to say here. If you want to use HNNR and HNCS, there is currently no sensible workflow - apart from export and further processing as TIFF, which I don't prefer.

Since HNNR is currently only available in the app and I am convinced of the amazing implementation of denoising and in many cases would no longer want to do without it, the pure Hasselblad workflow is not possible for me.

Hasselblad Natural Color Solution (HNCS) is achieved through the use of Phocus regardless of whether it's a desktop or mobile version like Phocus Mobile 2. "Editing photos captured by Hasselblad cameras in Phocus Mobile 2 can render true-to-life colours, fully unleashing the advantages of the Hasselblad Natural Colour Solution (HNCS)."

Some photographers want to edit using a mobile app because it fits their needs and others don't. It's your choice.

It's true that the new HNNR noise reduction feature has been made available first on the mobile platform and is not currently a feature of the desktop version. One thing of which I'm fairly certain is that we will continue to see new hardware and software options in the future. 

You can survey and choose from the incredible variety of tools available today and put them to good use in whatever way works best for you. You can also choose to frequently complain at every opportunity on every forum about what is or is not available to you today if you wish.

You can also make recommendations and provide constructive feedback to manufacturers in order to open a positive dialog with them. Whatever you find is the most productive use of your time, I encourage you to pursue it.

Best wishes for ever better light and a brighter future ahead.

Not sure I choose to complain on every forum. But I do choose to point out issues within platforms that I have invested it. I guess that's what I thought one of main reasons of forums was.

I purchased the X2D to utilize HNCS. The camera has an issue with noise at times that can become detrimental to an image in the form of hot pixels. Hasselblad created an excellent tool HNNR  but totally overlooked the desktop software solution as if everything is going to be done on a mobile platform going forward.

This issue has been taken forward to their support team by myself and others with no release of when it might be resolved.

So I guess we can agree to disagree.

Paul

Paul, your comparison of the tonal and color rendering between an X2D file rendered with LR versus the same file rendered with Phocus shows obvious differences. However, the two files were rendered with significant post processing adjustments. If different choices were made in the selection and strength of those adjustments, that may explain the different renderings rather than any inherent difference in the starting point offered by the LR and Phocus. One adjustment I noticed you made in the LR file was a global +22 Dehaze Adjustment. There is nothing comparable to Dehaze in Phocus. It is a very powerful tool that sometimes works great and other times not so much. I can't see the rest of the adjustments that you made in the two files, so I can't tell what else may have been done. If one wants to compare how well LR preserves the HNCS, I think it would be more instructive to show comparisons where only very basic global adjustments were applied, like exposure, shadows, highlights and curves.

Quote from: hcubell on March 24, 2025, 03:38:45 AMPaul, your comparison of the tonal and color rendering between an X2D file rendered with LR and versus the same file rendered with Phocus shows obvious differences. However, the two files were rendered with significant post processing adjustments. If different choices were made in the selection and strength of those adjustments, that may explain the different renderings rather than any inherent difference in the starting point offered by the LR and Phocus. One adjustment I noticed you made in the LR file was a global +22 Dehaze Adjustment. There is nothing comparable to Dehaze in Phocus. It is a very powerful tool that sometimes works great and other times not so much. I can't see the rest of the adjustments that you made in the two files, so I can't tell what else may have been done. If one wants to compare how well LR preserves the HNCS, I think it would be more instructive to show comparisons where only very basic global adjustments were applied, like exposure, shadows, highlights and curves.

Also, Matt proved that using LR with the correct profile (I don't remember which one) showed close to no differences to a file processed through Phocus, as Hasselblad worked with LR to offer the best results for those working with it only. However, I think, from his examples too, that HNNR is a bit better than LR noise treatment, but it's pixel peeping at that point, and the examples were limited.

Quote from: niviblad on March 24, 2025, 06:18:48 AM

Quote from: hcubell on March 24, 2025, 03:38:45 AMPaul, your comparison of the tonal and color rendering between an X2D file rendered with LR and versus the same file rendered with Phocus shows obvious differences. However, the two files were rendered with significant post processing adjustments. If different choices were made in the selection and strength of those adjustments, that may explain the different renderings rather than any inherent difference in the starting point offered by the LR and Phocus. One adjustment I noticed you made in the LR file was a global +22 Dehaze Adjustment. There is nothing comparable to Dehaze in Phocus. It is a very powerful tool that sometimes works great and other times not so much. I can't see the rest of the adjustments that you made in the two files, so I can't tell what else may have been done. If one wants to compare how well LR preserves the HNCS, I think it would be more instructive to show comparisons where only very basic global adjustments were applied, like exposure, shadows, highlights and curves.

Also, Matt proved that using LR with the correct profile (I don't remember which one) showed close to no differences to a file processed through Phocus, as Hasselblad worked with LR to offer the best results for those working with it only. However, I think, from his examples too, that HNNR is a bit better than LR noise treatment, but it's pixel peeping at that point, and the examples were limited.

Well, I showed it for one image, at least.   

That is true... I thought you were also absolutely convinced it was the case all the time. I wonder if Paul did use the correct profile. If so, it shows LR can't always match Phocus results, which is interesting...

I, for one, don't care, as I don't like LR and only need Phocus desktop for professional work. For personal use, Phocus mobile is unbeatable, although I'm a bit concerned by the color fidelity of my IPhone (not even talking about True Tone...), and my future IPad M4. When I print, not often, I use Phocus desktop, then Photoshop for little adjustments and corrections.

Phocus Desktop 3.8.5 was released yesterday, still no fix.

Paul C

Quote from: Paul2660 on March 30, 2025, 04:20:12 AMPhocus Desktop 3.8.5 was released yesterday, still no fix.

Paul C

Did Hasselblad claim that it works with Phocus Desktop?